Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Server: Warriors of the Shadow, Faction: Sith Empire, Guild: Dreampiece
User avatar
GoomZ
Forum Troll
Posts: 14
Joined: Dec 21st, 2011, 7:06 pm
PSN: BRIANBURNSRED
Steam: GoomZ
Xbox Live: d 1 e b o y
Origin ID: Scowal

Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby GoomZ » Feb 12th, 2012, 4:16 pm

Hello everyboderp,

I'm just curious what people think of the game so far and if there is anything that you feel is a major issue or needs to be fixed. The official SWTOR forums are out of control, it is nothing but negative threads for the most part from a bunch of whiny people.

In my opinion, things may be broken in some areas, but that is nothing new to MMOs. I'm sure BioWare will get around to fixing everything eventually, but why not just avoid the major issues and look at them as incomplete for now and go on with your leveling or dungeon...ing...I mean, look at WoW, game was so broken and lacked content for a good while when it was released, but you could still have fun. Go get a group and go world PVP somewhere and annoy people trying to level, etc.

I overall, although did quit for about a week or 2, have discovered that I really do like this game and see great potential in it and will continue to play for awhile regardless of how long it takes BioWare to fix some issues.

Now for my main issues, maybe 1 more action-bar would be great, improve speed on mounts a tad bit as traveling is already enough of a chore, and since traveling is a chore, a queue system for instancing. i know people dont want to turn it into a system that does everything for you, but i think WoW's queuing system is great. plus, no one wants to take the time in SWTOR to find a group just because of the traveling system. i mean sit there all day and maybe find some groups, or go quest and queue for PVP for additional exp to level faster? i choose the 2nd option.
Warriors of the Shadow - PVP West
Silex - Sith Assassin
Cylex - Cyborg BH (not sure yet)
Autoaim - Human IA (going sniper)

User avatar
Benny
Dreampiece Founder
Posts: 3370
Joined: Jan 4th, 2009, 6:36 pm
PSN: Dreampiece
Steam: bennysoo
Wii: 0384-8082-7959-9771
Xbox Live: S7th
Origin ID: bennysoo
Location: San Francisco, CA
Contact:

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby Benny » Feb 12th, 2012, 4:50 pm

My current issues and views on SWTOR:

THE PROBABLY TOO LATE TO BE IMPLEMENTED LIST:
-Only 2 factions ruin the game, it always has with balancing on PVP queues, Ilum base camps, and more...
-Smugglers and Bounty Hunters should be neutral or able to be on either side
-Lack of Star Wars ie. setting bounties on people, a real cantina for enjoyment, Droid races, Wookie races, tons more missing like being able to go dark V and change from Repub to Sith
-Instead of making 1 Jedi and 1 Sith class they split it into 4 and then 8... was it really necessary? Could have made better classes for fun like Tuskan Raider class or something...
-Diversifying gear with unique abilities and randomization... like Diablo 2 with the rares/uniques... would be cool to have a blaster pistol to be able to do something a sniper can do...

THE WHY WASN'T THIS IN THE GAME BEFORE IT LAUNCHED LIST:
-Lack of sandbox elements ie. Podracing, Dejarik, Pazaak, and droid building, Guild housing, Player Housing, and gambling on Huttball
-Simple things that should have been inside SWTOR before it launched, functioning sorts, guild bank, guild alliances, full 8 man group queue for PVP, and more

THE BAD:
-Expertise benefits both damage and mitigation of damage makes new level 50s get ass raped
-Again 2 factions... factions make unnecessary balancing needs and caused the generic mirrors of classes... It almost seems like they were forced to make a class do certain things
-Gear all gear is practically the same in the game if it has modifiable slots, makes for a dull game
-Ilum, piece of crap waste of time worth of base camping... I am the base camper and I am complaining so you know it is bad... why they don't make more incentive for people to roam the 12031904810934810948 mile big zone? Why not make the walkers mountable?
-Voidstar and Civil War should probably allow same faction on faction for more diverse queues.
-Limiting commendations, valor rank, and PVP bags before level 50... WHY? WHY WAS THIS DONE MUTHER FUICKERS!!! FUCK YOU BW FOR THIS!!!!
-Legacy... If I knew about this... I would have leveled to 50 as fast as I could
-Space is a waste of time right now... it is basically a warp portal for you to go from point A to point B.
-Companions are the piece of crap that makes this game crappy... I have yet to use my companions since solo leveling to 50.... oh and crafting.

THE GOOD:
-Huttball PVP Warzone is probably the only reason I still play SWTOR... only PVP that requires skill/gear not just gear to win
-The Class story was somewhat nice and made leveling a breeze to go through

This game officially has until the next best MMO to release to make things happen! They are trying, but not in the right places imo... instead of worrying about giving 4 different options for action bar refresh UI... they should be working on major bugs and making this game at least = to WOW on non content related things. SWTOR is actually equivalent to RIFT right now to me.
[b]PSN: Dreampiece | 360: S7th | Wii: 0384-8082-7959-9771 | Steam: bennysoo | Origin: bennysoo

User avatar
GoomZ
Forum Troll
Posts: 14
Joined: Dec 21st, 2011, 7:06 pm
PSN: BRIANBURNSRED
Steam: GoomZ
Xbox Live: d 1 e b o y
Origin ID: Scowal

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby GoomZ » Feb 12th, 2012, 5:23 pm

I can totally agree with you Benny, RIFT was mediocre to me and I really did not have faith in Trion to make a great game, so I quit. It was fun though, but maybe a little TOO much was added to the game where as WoW is perfectly balanced. I mean my rogue had 203941920 skills I could use in RIFT, I did not like that lol.

But, I have faith in BioWare. If they want to keep the game good... get working on some of the major bugs, release new content of new PVP areas, extra features like you noted, new races, and maybe cheat and look at Blizzard's timeline of major changes to WoW so they can do it right, rather than just keep patching issues no one cares about.

Anywho, BW has a big team, I am sure they are working on the major things and already have ideas for newer content, its just too soon for it. I can almost guarantee a wookie race in the future.
Warriors of the Shadow - PVP West
Silex - Sith Assassin
Cylex - Cyborg BH (not sure yet)
Autoaim - Human IA (going sniper)

User avatar
FrogurtX
Blame Tim, We All Do!
Blame Tim, We All Do!
Posts: 1830
Joined: Jan 5th, 2009, 1:13 pm

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby FrogurtX » Feb 12th, 2012, 6:19 pm

Benny wrote:Only 2 factions ruin the game, it always has with balancing on PVP queues, Ilum base camps, and more...

This will always be the case in MMOs because society likes dualistic elements--Good VS Bad, Right VS Wrong, Red VS Blue. It makes people feel at ease because they can easily identify who the enemy is and who to direct their nerdrage at. Think of battleground queues as well, you will have to wait longer just to get 3 even teams (there is a problem with getting even teams for just 2 sides already).

Also, mmo developers are all too lazy to put in the sheer volume of work it would take to balance 3 factions (it's hard enough for them to balance 2) and also create enough content for all 3 factions (people already bitch about a lack of content for 2 factions).

Benny wrote:Instead of making 1 Jedi and 1 Sith class they split it into 4 and then 8... was it really necessary? Could have made better classes for fun like Tuskan Raider class or something...

I remember watching an interview from one of the developers on this topic. Their reasoning was that in the well known universe of Star Wars, a majority of their playerbase will want to play the high profile god-characters like Jedi and Sith. Who wants to be a Gungun? A droid? or Hutt? I mean some will want to be popular characters like Wookie or Bobba Fett-type, but cannon-wise, a Jedi/Sith will always rape a non-Jedi/Sith so why would you play as anyone else? So if they only had 1 Jedi and 1 Sith class, the MMO would consist of basically 2 classes, because everyone would want to play as those two. Well maybe bounty hunter, but look how fast Luke took out Bobba Fett and Bobba was the BEST bounty hunter--bounty hunters are shit compared to force wielders.

You also have a balancing nightmare if you only had 1 Jedi and 1 Sith. Who would fill the tank role? DPS? Would Tuscan Raider ever have better tanking than a Jedi? Would it ever have better DPS than a Sith? Better healing than a Jedi? More importantly, would that ever make sense if they did?

By splitting up the Jedi/Sith class into 4-8 versions, it ensures players have more of a choice in classes and also helps define them so they have a role in parties and BGs. Now you have a "tank", "healer", "DPS", etc. so you can form a balanced party or arena team.


Benny wrote:Expertise benefits both damage and mitigation of damage makes new level 50s get ass raped

People who reach the level cap need a reason to continue playing, especially if there is no additional content for them. Also players who play longer SHOULD be stronger than those who have not played longer. Wouldn't you be pissed if you ground out a month worth of perks/achievements and were just as strong as a person who just got to your level?

This reminds me of Rawrmin's complaint about new WoW expansion gear being just as strong as the old hard-to-get gear that you guys spent a lot of time earning. Now new players can easily be just as strong as people who spent a lot of time getting the old gear. It's why everyone quit WoW if I remember correctly. Now you are complaining in SWTOR that old level 50s who ground out their perks are too strong and you should be just as strong because you just got to the same level.

=========

Everything else you mentioned are good points! Also full disclosure, I've never played SWTOR.

User avatar
Benny
Dreampiece Founder
Posts: 3370
Joined: Jan 4th, 2009, 6:36 pm
PSN: Dreampiece
Steam: bennysoo
Wii: 0384-8082-7959-9771
Xbox Live: S7th
Origin ID: bennysoo
Location: San Francisco, CA
Contact:

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby Benny » Feb 12th, 2012, 7:26 pm

FrogurtX wrote:
Benny wrote:Only 2 factions ruin the game, it always has with balancing on PVP queues, Ilum base camps, and more...

This will always be the case in MMOs because society likes dualistic elements--Good VS Bad, Right VS Wrong, Red VS Blue. It makes people feel at ease because they can easily identify who the enemy is and who to direct their nerdrage at. Think of battleground queues as well, you will have to wait longer just to get 3 even teams (there is a problem with getting even teams for just 2 sides already).

Also, mmo developers are all too lazy to put in the sheer volume of work it would take to balance 3 factions (it's hard enough for them to balance 2) and also create enough content for all 3 factions (people already bitch about a lack of content for 2 factions).

Benny wrote:Instead of making 1 Jedi and 1 Sith class they split it into 4 and then 8... was it really necessary? Could have made better classes for fun like Tuskan Raider class or something...

I remember watching an interview from one of the developers on this topic. Their reasoning was that in the well known universe of Star Wars, a majority of their playerbase will want to play the high profile god-characters like Jedi and Sith. Who wants to be a Gungun? A droid? or Hutt? I mean some will want to be popular characters like Wookie or Bobba Fett-type, but cannon-wise, a Jedi/Sith will always rape a non-Jedi/Sith so why would you play as anyone else? So if they only had 1 Jedi and 1 Sith class, the MMO would consist of basically 2 classes, because everyone would want to play as those two. Well maybe bounty hunter, but look how fast Luke took out Bobba Fett and Bobba was the BEST bounty hunter--bounty hunters are shit compared to force wielders.

You also have a balancing nightmare if you only had 1 Jedi and 1 Sith. Who would fill the tank role? DPS? Would Tuscan Raider ever have better tanking than a Jedi? Would it ever have better DPS than a Sith? Better healing than a Jedi? More importantly, would that ever make sense if they did?

By splitting up the Jedi/Sith class into 4-8 versions, it ensures players have more of a choice in classes and also helps define them so they have a role in parties and BGs. Now you have a "tank", "healer", "DPS", etc. so you can form a balanced party or arena team.


Benny wrote:Expertise benefits both damage and mitigation of damage makes new level 50s get ass raped

People who reach the level cap need a reason to continue playing, especially if there is no additional content for them. Also players who play longer SHOULD be stronger than those who have not played longer. Wouldn't you be pissed if you ground out a month worth of perks/achievements and were just as strong as a person who just got to your level?

This reminds me of Rawrmin's complaint about new WoW expansion gear being just as strong as the old hard-to-get gear that you guys spent a lot of time earning. Now new players can easily be just as strong as people who spent a lot of time getting the old gear. It's why everyone quit WoW if I remember correctly. Now you are complaining in SWTOR that old level 50s who ground out their perks are too strong and you should be just as strong because you just got to the same level.

=========

Everything else you mentioned are good points! Also full disclosure, I've never played SWTOR.


I think factionless is the way to go actually or starter factions to give players guidance then when they mature they can just jump ship like FFXI. Guilds are pointless in MMOs almost... you can get the same effect of making a private channel and have everyone join it. They need to make Guilds a bigger impact in the game... I recall back in the days there were games where guilds stake plots of land and guilds would battle it out... none of that exists anymore makes me sad.

People who reach the level cap need a reason to continue playing but maybe sandbox elements can help with that. Having a sports game in the game for example, having Tetra Master, Dejarik, etc etc can keep people playing beyond the level cap. Think if every monster had a chance to drop a randomized stat card of the monster... it would be like diablo 2 all over again. Combine the elements of RO's card finding mechanics with an advanced Tetramaster like game... this lets people use cards in their gear and use it to play social games while waiting to down a stupid dragon. RO did a great job where even shitty gear was valuable in one way or another... I loved it how blacksmiths played a crucial part of the game... I loved how you could turn your mage into a tank via stat and gear changes... most MMOs lack this... RO had everyone start out as the same decaying matter with a quest to pick your future job... or stay jobless. RO, FFXI, and other old games like EQ, SWG, DaoC had good in them that none of the upcoming MMOs take for use.

They should have made Jedi and Sith just one class each and have them branch out as a tree to allow for more unique classes that are not mirrors of each other. The Jedi can be a tank, healer, or dps... just have different skill trees to climb. Also not everyone wants a lightsaber and be like Vader and Luke. If Tuskan Raiders were available I would have loved to play one... sniping pro with bantha mounts! If the Jedi were so powerful how did it end up being only 1 Jedi in the end right? If I were to think up classes it would have been this(no factions from the start of the game):
-Force User
-Bounty Hunter
-Smuggler
-Spy
-Raider
-Soldier

Lastly just because people play longer doesn't mean they can be stronger... lets say I practice playing basketball since age 6 til now it doesn't mean I am better than Michael Jordan or even any of the bench squad members. Just because I wear a helmet and padded armor doesn't make me a good football player. They just need to put skill in the picture more... A game where skill can give you the edge even against well geared players. Rurouni Kenshin had a blunt sword and was able to beat the hell out of gun users... skill > equipment... time helps build skill, but doesn't always make you better is what I am saying. Not everyone is worthy of Excalibur so just because you have it doesn't mean you are king of your realm.

In short what I want would probably not happen unless I win the MEGA million and start up a game company for myself... I guess I should stick to FPS and watch TV/Movies.
[b]PSN: Dreampiece | 360: S7th | Wii: 0384-8082-7959-9771 | Steam: bennysoo | Origin: bennysoo

User avatar
GoomZ
Forum Troll
Posts: 14
Joined: Dec 21st, 2011, 7:06 pm
PSN: BRIANBURNSRED
Steam: GoomZ
Xbox Live: d 1 e b o y
Origin ID: Scowal

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby GoomZ » Feb 12th, 2012, 7:51 pm

another issue i have is the split in zones. like if im in a zone in taris, there can be 10 players, and instance 2 or whatever has 10 or so. i guess the level design created this, but this totally takes away the opportunity to get into groups with players (a lot quicker since you would run into them) and zone heroics and for larger world PVP. kind of a huge bummer to be honest. swtor just feels like a large single player game for the most part. granted, no one really PVPs in WoW anymore, and you don't run into much players in WoW anyways outside of BGs, it still would be nice to have in SWTOR.

i think i have came across a total of maybe 5-8 republic players up to level 41...

this made wow exciting, because you did not know what to expect while on a PVP server. im hoping they do something so i dont run out of gas for SWTOR. at the moment, it is acceptable, and im sure ill find a way to go to a zone and ruin some peoples day once i hit 50, but eventually it will dry out from the lack of visible players.
Warriors of the Shadow - PVP West
Silex - Sith Assassin
Cylex - Cyborg BH (not sure yet)
Autoaim - Human IA (going sniper)

User avatar
Benny
Dreampiece Founder
Posts: 3370
Joined: Jan 4th, 2009, 6:36 pm
PSN: Dreampiece
Steam: bennysoo
Wii: 0384-8082-7959-9771
Xbox Live: S7th
Origin ID: bennysoo
Location: San Francisco, CA
Contact:

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby Benny » Feb 12th, 2012, 8:15 pm

GoomZ wrote:another issue i have is the split in zones. like if im in a zone in taris, there can be 10 players, and instance 2 or whatever has 10 or so. i guess the level design created this, but this totally takes away the opportunity to get into groups with players (a lot quicker since you would run into them) and zone heroics and for larger world PVP. kind of a huge bummer to be honest. swtor just feels like a large single player game for the most part. granted, no one really PVPs in WoW anymore, and you don't run into much players in WoW anyways outside of BGs, it still would be nice to have in SWTOR.

i think i have came across a total of maybe 5-8 republic players up to level 41...

this made wow exciting, because you did not know what to expect while on a PVP server. im hoping they do something so i dont run out of gas for SWTOR. at the moment, it is acceptable, and im sure ill find a way to go to a zone and ruin some peoples day once i hit 50, but eventually it will dry out from the lack of visible players.

Sad... I don't think any of the upcoming MMOs are going to do any better with these type of things. MMOs spend years making great landscapes and stuff for low level players and after the game has been around those low level areas become ghost towns. I think Blizzard may be doing the smartest thing with their new expansion bringing in Pokemon action... making players of all levels roam in the wild in all level bracket areas to find rare pets. I think this is the best thing a MMO can be doing... adding sandbox flavor to the game.

My Dream MMO would be like this:
-RO's card modding system
-Tetra master game system using above cards
-Majority of gear being unbound and tradeable with minor penalties... ie big raid dungeon boss drops a sword but you don't need it when you trade it the power grows weaker for someone who has not beat the boss
-Diablo like stats on random dropped items, making killing random mobs worth doing in the wild
-FFXI's unlocking of jobs system and multiclassing on one account
-Character stats being able to be modifiable so you can mold your character
-Guild housing/takeovers similar to WoE on RO
-Factionless... everyone starts in the same world
-Bounties on unruly players that make those players FFA for people
-One massive server like EVE
-Guilds meaning more than just a chatroom, guild emblems, guild alliances/rivalries like RO
-Level-less, the longer you play the more learned you are at the game... learn skills from adventuring/raids/pvp rather than levels
-Active combat system, ranged players must aim with a crosshair to shoot, melee needs to actively attack/block/dodge/counter, fighting on mounts is possible
-Death has to have a severe penalty to prevent people from griefing and vice versa... lose a random item maybe... since gear will be tradeable this should be fine
-The endgame should begin right when you start to play the game... overall game should be fun regardless of how long you played

The closest game I have ever seen like this was MUD.
[b]PSN: Dreampiece | 360: S7th | Wii: 0384-8082-7959-9771 | Steam: bennysoo | Origin: bennysoo

User avatar
FrogurtX
Blame Tim, We All Do!
Blame Tim, We All Do!
Posts: 1830
Joined: Jan 5th, 2009, 1:13 pm

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby FrogurtX » Feb 12th, 2012, 8:27 pm

@ Benny:

Factionless can work too. I just don't think anything other than Factionless or 2-Faction can work.

It seems you want a more skill-based MMO. There are those out there that are trying to bridge FPS and MMO, but you are playing a MMORPG WoW clone and it won't happen. You may have to look to that new genre of FPSMMO.

I think you should try Wakfu out with me because it has a lot of the weird sometimes innovative and "rough" Ragnarok Elements that you liked. It's somewhat skill-based, builds can be switched up without rerolling and it's graphics are similar. Hop on and roll a character with, prolly just take a couple hours to get the gist.

@ Goomz:
Just a theory, but I think at this early stage, the playerbase has separated into like 80/20, where 80% of players are at level 50 and 20% are <20 and you can't find anyone in leveling areas for 21-49. As time goes on and the playerbase grows and people make alts, you should have a more even distribution at any given level. Near the end of the game's life cycle when no new players are joining, the distribution should be more like 95/5.

User avatar
GoomZ
Forum Troll
Posts: 14
Joined: Dec 21st, 2011, 7:06 pm
PSN: BRIANBURNSRED
Steam: GoomZ
Xbox Live: d 1 e b o y
Origin ID: Scowal

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby GoomZ » Feb 12th, 2012, 8:32 pm

FrogurtX wrote:@ Goomz:
Just a theory, but I think at this early stage, the playerbase has separated into like 80/20, where 80% of players are at level 50 and 20% are <20 and you can't find anyone in leveling areas for 21-49. As time goes on and the playerbase grows and people make alts, you should have a more even distribution at any given level. Near the end of the game's life cycle when no new players are joining, the distribution should be more like 95/5.


no, that makes perfect sense. i played when it was first released up to about 5 days prior than the official date, and zones were slammed with players, so you definitely are right. i just hope they open up more "spaceships" as well, like how WoW has dalaran, orgrimmar, etc where most of the players chill, rather than a crowded ImpFleet. this though isn't really an issue and i imagine they will open up more "spaceships" in the future.
Warriors of the Shadow - PVP West
Silex - Sith Assassin
Cylex - Cyborg BH (not sure yet)
Autoaim - Human IA (going sniper)

User avatar
FrogurtX
Blame Tim, We All Do!
Blame Tim, We All Do!
Posts: 1830
Joined: Jan 5th, 2009, 1:13 pm

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby FrogurtX » Feb 12th, 2012, 8:49 pm

@ Benny:

- RO's card modding system was nothing more than inserting stat gems into socketed equipment. The cards were like .00000001% droprate which made it a grind and NOT FUN.
- People don't like minigames on their MMO, I think you were like the only person who played Tetra Master on FFXI, lol.
- Interesting concept with applying a penalty to tradable unbound gear. It may be the best of bound (which I totally agree with) VS unbound gear mechanics.
- I think MMOs benefits from a large array of equipment (drops or crafted)-- Agree.
- Totally agree with FFXI's multiclassing system--loved it.
- Mixed feelings on this because in RO, if you misapplied a single stat your character was completely fubar and you either needed to buy an expensive reset item or reroll. This made me really frustrated with RO. With games like WoW where they allocate your stats for you, you're char customization comes from what your spec is, and they would all be somewhat effective.
- WoE on RO was unique and interesting.
- Factionless, it can work, but it would be a bit boring. You have no one to direct nerd rage towards and everyone would start in the same areas. These areas would get really packed and KSing would occur. There would not be any variety to rolling alts because it would be the same mobs and the same leveling area progression all over again.
- Bounties are good. I like adding player contributed elements like how Eve has. This is why I like Wakfu.
- RO had a good guild system. Gave everyone a nice little guild emblem and title. Wakfu does it like this too.
- Skill-based MMO--this may be a different genre of MMO. I personally like the idea of skill-based MMOs, but sometimes I want a mindless game to zone out on, rather than a twitch-based FPS.
- Death penalty, I dunno about this one. Early MMOs did this and it always pissed me off. Deleveling in FFXI and exp penalty in RO was really frustrating and made me want to stop playing. Losing equipment from death like in MUD was very similar, especially when I lost it in the Underdark and couldn't retrieve it because it was.. well dark and I didn't have a torch because I was naked.
- The endgame cannot be at the very start of the game because it will get boring. What will you have to look forward to when you are leveling? If you have already experienced it, then there will be no point in continuing. It's like logging into your level 1 character and getting every skill available to you. Wakfu kind of does this, and I don't like it.


I think you are looking for a Diablo 2 style MMO. It's skill-based, has death penalties, and plays like RO (top down mouse control).


Return to “Star Wars: The Old Republic”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest