Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Server: Warriors of the Shadow, Faction: Sith Empire, Guild: Dreampiece
User avatar
Benny
Dreampiece Founder
Posts: 3370
Joined: Jan 4th, 2009, 6:36 pm
PSN: Dreampiece
Steam: bennysoo
Wii: 0384-8082-7959-9771
Xbox Live: S7th
Origin ID: bennysoo
Location: San Francisco, CA
Contact:

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby Benny » Mar 30th, 2012, 8:31 am

Dwayne wrote:
Benny wrote:I feel dungeons in games should not be a grind fest each week for gear/points. This turns me off greatly... Do you play a console RPG that you can beat in eight hours each week? That is kind of what end game dungeons are like to me... it is like replaying your last save before the boss fights in a console RPG each week for God knows what reason. I am the one and done type espeically for instances. I feel like I slayed the great dragon of whatever... NEXT. I think the MMO genre needs to evolve and rely more heavily on the community to drive content to supplement. EVE is a great example of a good MMO imo. If the learning curve was lighter and maybe on foot like most other MMOs, it could be a thing of beauty.


It's really starting to look like you just don't like RPGs or the Genre, Benny... Wait for CS:GO all your problems will be solved.

Possible, but I enjoy the process of mostly all MMORPGs that I have tried until the endgame. A few I could not stand even the leveling process (Age of Conan and FFXIV off the top of my head). Like Xeno, SWTOR was very cool up until the end of the game. At the end game in SWTOR it becomes a grindfest for gear, and sadly the gear are too similar to trigger a desire to spent many hours to get the same thing except with a higher stat value across the board. I should have seen it coming when I was in BETA seeing that all the PVP gear were numbered and named Melee DPS 12 Chest, Melee DPS 14 Chest, Ranged DPS 10 Chest, etc. I also felt voice acting was a bad idea when it comes to your own character since it takes away from your own imagination.

I enjoy RPGs when I had the time to sit and play them in the past, ie. Final Fantasy Series, Legend of Zelda, Chrono Trigger, Secret of Mana, and .Hack. The thing is MMORPGs seem to be having this problem with Endgame content... I feel that with an MMORPG there should be no feeling of the end or having nothing to do. It is a massive multiplayer online role playing game, not the I live on the Imperial Fleet next to the quest box game. Like I mentioned before the genre needs more sandbox elements to keep players more engaged and not just on "raid nights". Maybe if SWTOR made crafting more worthwhile and making the crafting materials found on lower level monsters/etc it could make people travel around the vast world of Star Wars and open up Open World PVP on PVP servers. The companion system to me was a huge step backwards and hurt the MMO genre. Forcing players to have AI companions was a big turn off for me. It gave me another mouth to feed, a semi-forced incentive to keep having them go on missions.

Right now I am juggling SWTOR and Wakfu. Wakfu although 100x more buggy than SWTOR seems to engage me more even on the PVE/Dungeon running side. What keeps me interested in Wakfu is the variety of items, gear, and visual differences. I do find major flaws that will inevitably cause me to maybe get bored when I hit max level in the game as well. HOWEVER, the game is community driven! The whole game changes depending on what players are doing in the game... zones unlock by player effort, open world PVP amount goes from a 1 to a 10 when a governor of a country declares war... self made bounty systems that actually work, and the fact that there are more than 2 factions and classes are available to all factions causes some fun FFA fighting. EVE is also a game with no endgame which I feel is totally awesome and what all MMORPGs should be like! Grinding dungeons is cool and all but shouldn't be the end all content. If Blizzard's next MMO can add the functionality to have in-game bars that have televisions projecting Starcraft Matches... it can add a whole other element to the game and keep players having fun in the game when taking breaks from grinding etc.

Lastly CS:GO will be like every other FPS to me, fun for the first few months then eventually I will long for something else to supplement it. I think I just get bored quicker than most people so I need games that are highly customizable to keep me entertained ie. Diablo, Ragnarok, FFXI, Wakfu, Sims, Map editors. To be totally honest the most fun I had were in Ragnarok Online and FFXI... both due to the community involvement and minimal gear restrictions. Wakfu seems logical for me to enjoy for the very same reasons... Guild Wars 2 and Tera will most likely be another WOW, SWTOR, and WAR to me... while Secret World and Archeage will be more like an EVE, Minecraft, and DCUO to me. I am more interested in the MMORPG genre to evolve from what WOW inspired many other companies to do. What SWTOR did was take the fundamentals of Vanilla WOW and voice acting from DCUO and brought the Star Wars skins to overlay. SWG fanboys probably rage harder than I did when they found no sandbox goodness to the game. I longed to live in the Star Wars Galaxy... Where I would get into bar fights in the Cantina over the best looking holodancer, race people in Podracing for glory, Play Dejarik or Pazaak @ the Hutt casinos while waiting for friends to log on, barter with Jawas for a droid to maintain my estate that I built/purchased in the deserts of Tattooine from items/materials farmed from across the galaxy, and also dogfighting in space.

Sorry, just bitter because I love Star Wars so much.
[b]PSN: Dreampiece | 360: S7th | Wii: 0384-8082-7959-9771 | Steam: bennysoo | Origin: bennysoo

User avatar
rawrmin
Dreampiece Server Host Admin
Posts: 487
Joined: Jan 6th, 2009, 10:08 pm
Contact:

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby rawrmin » Mar 30th, 2012, 9:17 am

Swotr Games boring to linear and restricting. I already beat this game when it was called World of Warcraft.
Ramin Davarpanah
President & CEO
of
-Ramin Corp.-
"Making tomorrow safer for today."
http://www.ramincorporation.com

User avatar
Benny
Dreampiece Founder
Posts: 3370
Joined: Jan 4th, 2009, 6:36 pm
PSN: Dreampiece
Steam: bennysoo
Wii: 0384-8082-7959-9771
Xbox Live: S7th
Origin ID: bennysoo
Location: San Francisco, CA
Contact:

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby Benny » Mar 30th, 2012, 9:18 am

rawrmin wrote:Swotr Games boring to linear and restricting. I already beat this game when it was called World of Warcraft.

especially since you play and enjoy EVE right now.
Oh and I realized why I like Diablo II, Ragnarok Online, and Wakfu... your characters can be HEAVILY different than other people of the same class. Being able to modify every stat on your character and skills you use is pretty awesome. Compound this with the fact that almost any item is usable by anyone makes for interesting combo gear sets. Armor is not a factor in gear so sometimes wearing level 50 gear makes sense at level 100!
[b]PSN: Dreampiece | 360: S7th | Wii: 0384-8082-7959-9771 | Steam: bennysoo | Origin: bennysoo

User avatar
Dwayne
Topic Posting Engineer
Posts: 38
Joined: Jan 5th, 2009, 8:33 pm

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby Dwayne » Mar 30th, 2012, 4:18 pm

rawrmin wrote:Swotr Games boring to linear and restricting. I already beat this game when it was called World of Warcraft.


Called it.. why did I even bother to level you I don't know... lol

User avatar
Dwayne
Topic Posting Engineer
Posts: 38
Joined: Jan 5th, 2009, 8:33 pm

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby Dwayne » Mar 30th, 2012, 4:22 pm

What's weird is people in EVE have to make limitations and restrict themselves to have any fun.. When Ramin told me about the RED vs BLUE it all made sense.. So the problem here is people don't want their hands held.. but without hand holding you won't get the critical amounts of users to keep an MMO running. EVE Online is struggling to make a profit from their game.

User avatar
Benny
Dreampiece Founder
Posts: 3370
Joined: Jan 4th, 2009, 6:36 pm
PSN: Dreampiece
Steam: bennysoo
Wii: 0384-8082-7959-9771
Xbox Live: S7th
Origin ID: bennysoo
Location: San Francisco, CA
Contact:

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby Benny » Mar 30th, 2012, 4:58 pm

Dwayne wrote:What's weird is people in EVE have to make limitations and restrict themselves to have any fun.. When Ramin told me about the RED vs BLUE it all made sense.. So the problem here is people don't want their hands held.. but without hand holding you won't get the critical amounts of users to keep an MMO running. EVE Online is struggling to make a profit from their game.

True... Transgaming is where it needs to go... EVE is looking to have their FPS Dust game have impact to EVE MMO... just think if your mom who plays farmville at work can have an impact in your MMO for planting and harvesting! F2P/Cash item stuff might be the future potentially... or do what Blizzard plans on doing with the real money transactions with D3.
[b]PSN: Dreampiece | 360: S7th | Wii: 0384-8082-7959-9771 | Steam: bennysoo | Origin: bennysoo

User avatar
Fyter87
L33T H4X0R
Posts: 51
Joined: Sep 27th, 2011, 4:49 pm
Location: San Francisco, CA

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby Fyter87 » Mar 30th, 2012, 5:41 pm

The only only reason I am still playing Swtor is cause of the people. If I had no friends playing, I wouldn't be playing at all. I hate saying it cause I wanted this game to be really good. Also I think even if they do change, fix and end up making it decent and fun to play, I feel like it still wont be a huge MMO. Some games need to make a first impression. I think most people are playing it cause its simply STAR WARS..

User avatar
Dwayne
Topic Posting Engineer
Posts: 38
Joined: Jan 5th, 2009, 8:33 pm

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby Dwayne » Mar 30th, 2012, 6:40 pm

Fyter87 wrote:The only only reason I am still playing Swtor is cause of the people. If I had no friends playing, I wouldn't be playing at all. I hate saying it cause I wanted this game to be really good. Also I think even if they do change, fix and end up making it decent and fun to play, I feel like it still wont be a huge MMO. Some games need to make a first impression. I think most people are playing it cause its simply STAR WARS..


I actually think this a problem with the genre.. MMOs give up so much just to let people play with other people synchronously but none of that really helps with making the game fun... I can't actually say I had fun in any MMO where I didn't have a few people I knew playing. It's a struggle for any social or "masssive" online game to keep people engaged but also being able to get new people (yes even WoW just look at the numbers). I've come to terms with this fact a long time ago. Theres already articles popping up about this. Transgaming can be a solution but development costs will go even higher through the roof with no payoff in sight.

We can all say things like we want this or we want that.. but in the end of the day do you think Bioware intended to make the product this way? Or is it just the nature of the beast. I'd go with the latter. Take it for what it is my philosophy at the moment.

User avatar
Benny
Dreampiece Founder
Posts: 3370
Joined: Jan 4th, 2009, 6:36 pm
PSN: Dreampiece
Steam: bennysoo
Wii: 0384-8082-7959-9771
Xbox Live: S7th
Origin ID: bennysoo
Location: San Francisco, CA
Contact:

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby Benny » Mar 31st, 2012, 4:20 am

Dwayne wrote:
Fyter87 wrote:The only only reason I am still playing Swtor is cause of the people. If I had no friends playing, I wouldn't be playing at all. I hate saying it cause I wanted this game to be really good. Also I think even if they do change, fix and end up making it decent and fun to play, I feel like it still wont be a huge MMO. Some games need to make a first impression. I think most people are playing it cause its simply STAR WARS..


I actually think this a problem with the genre.. MMOs give up so much just to let people play with other people synchronously but none of that really helps with making the game fun... I can't actually say I had fun in any MMO where I didn't have a few people I knew playing. It's a struggle for any social or "masssive" online game to keep people engaged but also being able to get new people (yes even WoW just look at the numbers). I've come to terms with this fact a long time ago. Theres already articles popping up about this. Transgaming can be a solution but development costs will go even higher through the roof with no payoff in sight.

We can all say things like we want this or we want that.. but in the end of the day do you think Bioware intended to make the product this way? Or is it just the nature of the beast. I'd go with the latter. Take it for what it is my philosophy at the moment.

Bioware followed the model that has been proven to make money for Blizzard. They could of made this more like SWG, but they decided against it... Same reason STO decided to go WOW like instead of EVE like... SWTOR instead of separating the classes to make them unique they mirrored them... I was raging when i found there are sith inquisitors and sith wars remember? I raged even harder when BH were a mirror of Trooper. Anyways I still think the PVP is engaging enough and I pray 1.2 throws in some cool features.
[b]PSN: Dreampiece | 360: S7th | Wii: 0384-8082-7959-9771 | Steam: bennysoo | Origin: bennysoo

User avatar
Marshall
Forum Veteran
Posts: 76
Joined: Aug 26th, 2011, 12:07 pm

Re: Your current issues and views on SWTOR

Postby Marshall » Apr 3rd, 2012, 1:50 pm

Benny wrote:I agree with you totally. If it wasn't my drive to PVP, I would have unsubscribed! Depending on how 1.2 does, I may have to unsubscribe as well anyways. Games with a max level/levels in general tend to be very limiting as a whole. When people say levels are meant to be a tutorial, I call total BS on that... everything you do while leveling pretty much is more fun then what you do in games at the END GAME. Before games were less fun and grindy until you get to end game, but now it is flopped or worst just grindy from start to finish. SWTOR is so strong on rails that it limits gear's stats to just exponential formulas. The difference between a level 50 piece of gear versus a level 10 is just that the stat values on the level 50 piece is higher! This bothers be a GREAT deal... no originality of gear and even the art of some of the gears are reused in a different shade of color. If it was to be so unoriginal why even make the sets right? Why have 3 level 50 PVP gear that are all around 7 stat points to each stat difference from each other?

I feel dungeons in games should not be a grind fest each week for gear/points. This turns me off greatly... Do you play a console RPG that you can beat in eight hours each week? That is kind of what end game dungeons are like to me... it is like replaying your last save before the boss fights in a console RPG each week for God knows what reason. I am the one and done type espeically for instances. I feel like I slayed the great dragon of whatever... NEXT. I think the MMO genre needs to evolve and rely more heavily on the community to drive content to supplement. EVE is a great example of a good MMO imo. If the learning curve was lighter and maybe on foot like most other MMOs, it could be a thing of beauty.


A couple things came to mind since I wrote that post and in reading your response. I actually miss the classic WoW level grind. That may sound crazy, but I miss when getting to max level was a real challenge for most people and involved a real commitment. "Barrens chat" was there because tons of casuals and kids didn't even level their characters past 20 or so and just sat around in the low level zones bs'ing. As WoW bumped their level cap, they made it easier and easier to level and now it's no big deal. I HATED the alliance with a passion while I was getting ganked by max levels with my lowbie Horde character and it really drove my PvP (and world PvP) passion and pushed me to get to max level. I had spent so much time with that character leveling that I really knew the class inside and out by max level and the difficulty transition to high level instances and raids was practically non-existent.

The other thing that came to mind was DIII's Inferno difficulty. If Inferno takes off in end-game popularity, it may provide a real alternative to the weekly raid grind that MMOs' end games have become. I was picturing an entire zone with random elites and random/rare super elites that you world raided with others. The difficulty would be high but the loot would be only yours (no rolling like the Panda XP is finally doing) and the loot tables would essentially be like zone drops with some exceptions for the rare mini bosses. They'd have to restrict flying mounts there like a BG, but they could also encourage world PvP in the same zone with special zone pvp rewards and missions. Old school Alterac Valley meets Molten Core. Sounds chaotic and exciting. Of course it would suffer on PvP servers with bad faction balance.


Return to “Star Wars: The Old Republic”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest